Tim Kaine & Mike Pence Face Off Tonight in VP Debate; Hurricane Matthew Takes Aim at East Coast; Auto Sales Slow Down; Trump



Matthew Takes Aim at East Coast; Auto Sales Slow Down; Trump

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[06:33:19] LLOYD BENTSEN (D), 1988 VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I served with Jack Kennedy. I knew Jack Kennedy. Jack Kennedy was a friend of mine.

Senator, you're no Jack Kennedy.



SARAH PALIN (R), FORMER ALASKA GOVERNOR: How long have I been at this, like five weeks?


CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: Those are some of the high moments. The problem is, they're some of the only high moments we have gotten from VP debates.

So, tonight what are the expectations when you have Governor Mike Pence and Senator Tim Kaine on the air? It's actually going to be really important in terms of shaping the state of play between these two tickets.

Let's bring back David Gregory, Matt Lewis, and David Chalian.

We remember those moments. You know, obviously, when you had Bentsen going at -- when you had Lloyd Bentsen going at Quayle, how Quayle was looking away at the moment, fixing --


But going into it tonight, what do you think can come out of it that matters?

DAVID GREGORY, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: I really think it's a proxy fight for the top of the ticket. I mean, in both cases, I think Kaine reinforces Hillary Clinton better than Pence reinforces Trump. Pence is a cultural conservative, you know, whereas the top of the ticket is not really conservative or even Republican from that point of view.

But I think they're going to fight at each other. I think Kaine is really going to go after the tax issue. I'm sure try to point out some of Pence's views about gay rights, for example, to try to motivate the Democratic base, particularly younger voters who I think that might resonate with.

I think there's a different state of play here. You don't have fundamental questions of fitness and qualification at the VP level, which you had, with Palin going back to Quayle as well. So I think it's a different dynamic.

CAMEROTA: But don't sell the VP debate short, because the Palin/Joe Biden one had 70 million viewers.

[06:35:02] People are interested. I mean, interested or entertained, whatever. They do tune in.

So, what do you think could be the headline out of tonight, Matt?

MATT LEWIS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I think the headline will be, can Mike Pence defend the indefensible?

GREGORY: I -- that's right.

LEWIS: He's going to be asked, Donald Trump said this, do you stand behind it?

So far, Mike Pence has actually been very good at preserving his own legacy and defending Donald, in some cases being the explainer in chief of Donald -- this is what Donald Trump meant and this is why.

CUOMO: So, Chalian, how does it play tonight? Mike Pence just got dealt a nice punch in the nose by the federal courts. Three-judge panel saying, you can't discriminate against refugees just because you think you're afraid of them. Do you think that's going to come into the state of play tonight in this debate, how he defends that?

DAVID CHALIAN, CNN POLITICAL DIRECTOR: There's no doubt that it will. Just as Matt and David were saying, I think each of the Trump policies, refugees being one of them is going to be standing there for Mike Pence to defend, with a mixed with his own record in Indiana, but also what Trump has been proposing.

He always does have to do that dance of loyal soldier and preserving his own political future, although, he has done it quite successfully. I think what you're looking at tonight, though, you have to look at the news environment that this debate is taking place in. I'm sure Tim Kaine is very thankful that this VP debate did not happen four weeks ago when Hillary Clinton was suffering a round of bad headlines about the Clinton Foundation or transparency or about her health. This comes now after a really rough week for Donald Trump which means as they entered the stage, Mike Pence is on the defensive immediately. CAMEROTA: Let's talk about that, David. How much time do you think will be spent of the running mates defending the top of their ticket, either Hillary Clinton or Donald Trump?

GREGORY: I think they're both going to have to do that. And I think they'll both try to be aggressive toward the top of the ticket on either side.

I also think foreign, policy, national security. You got "The Washington Post" editorializing today about the danger Trump could pose to the rest of the world. I think if you're Tim Kaine on the Armed Services Committee, you have that experience, you want to drive home that idea of fitness and qualifications for office.

Don't forget, the same issues for Trump. Is he qualified? Does he have the temperament? You know, the question of who is the stronger leader.

Hillary Clinton had a nice swing after this first debate on that. I think her running mate really wants to reinforce and Biden is one, Kaine is another who can speak to those voters, working class voters, men in particular, with whom she still struggles and she wants to try to make some inroads. The fact she made inroads with voters without a college degree, cutting I think in half what her deficit is, that's a big deal, because what she wants to do is minimize what she's losing there and then win women and minorities and all the rest. That really cuts off a path for him.

CUOMO: What about Kaine individually might be easy pickings for Pence?

LEWIS: Well, look, I think it would be a mistake if Mike Pence goes after Tim Kaine. We know the Republicans have put out some hit pieces recently about Tim Kaine, but I think this is about the top of the ticket, because nobody is going to say that Mike Pence isn't ready to be a heartbeat away from the presidency. Nobody is going to say that Tim Kaine can't be a heartbeat away.

The question I think is over the principles at the top of the ticket. And if you look at those debates we saw earlier, you know, Dan Quayle and George H.W. Bush went on to win despite that knockout in the debate. Even Sarah Palin I think arguably beat Joe Biden in that presidential debate, of course, she loses to Barack Obama and John McCain loses. I don't think the vice presidential debates in and of themselves are dispositive.

CAMEROTA: David --

CHALIAN: You got to remember --

CAMEROTA: Go ahead, David.

CHALIAN: Sorry, I was just going to say, you look at our new poll. We saw the favorable/unfavorables. Both Mike Pence and Tim Kaine are viewed more favorably with the public. That's not the case at the top of the ticket for eight candidate. So, I would imagine that both presidential candidates are hoping that goodwill that Kaine and Pence have with the voters right now rubs off on them a little bit.

GREGORY: I'm sure we're going to come out of tonight like in some VP debates in the past -- I remember in 2000 with Lieberman and Cheney saying, why aren't these guys running for president? They're more positive toward each other. This is a good discussion of world affairs. Less personally nasty --

LEWIS: Two serious guys who know policy, have experience.

CAMEROTA: It's a little late for that.


GREGORY: No, but I really -- the whole issue of Pence twisting himself in knots, you know, defending Trump, that's going to the show to watch.

CAMEROTA: OK. Thanks so much, panel. Great to talk to you.

Well, the vice presidential nominees, as we've been saying, Mike Pence and Tim Kaine, do face off tonight 9:00 p.m. Eastern. CNN's debate coverage begins at 4:00.

CUOMO: The East Coast is on alert, as you know, because of powerful Hurricane Matthew. It's pummeling Haiti, setting its sights on the U.S. Chad Myers has the latest forecast track, next.


[06:43:36] CUOMO: All right. Take a look up at the screen for this. Hurricane Mathew threatening to devastate Haiti. Just take a look at the size of this monstrous storm.

We have images, please put them up there, captured by NASA from the International Space Station. All of that white is the storm. You think you're looking at the sky. You're actually looking down. That's the eye. You see the hole in the middle?

CAMEROTA: I do, I do.

CUOMO: So, it's huge. You're going to have not just those island nations but you're going to have the states, Florida, North Carolina, declaring states of emergency ahead of the arrival of this storm because of what they're expecting.

For details, meteorologist Chad Myers joins us now. What is the concern?

CHAD MYERS, AMS METEOROLOGIST: The concern is that 24 hours ago, we were looking at a storm off the East Coast of about 200 miles. Now, Cape Canaveral may be less than 60 miles. The models have turned left. The models have turned toward the U.S. Right now, the storm is making landfall in Haiti at 145 miles per hour.

This is a monster category for almost a 5. Winds 175 miles per hour moving north at 9 miles per hour, jogged a little to the right, making landfall right now. It's a category 4 hurricane. Not quite up to 5, but it's very big.

The hurricane now will get torn up a little bit by the land in Haiti. But there is the forecast track. Notice up in Florida how close it is.

[06:45:00] At that point, at that point of that closest landfall right there in almost Cape Canaveral, for now, we go left and right, but this storm is still going to be 120 miles per hour. So, a monster storm still heading for the U.S.

Models turning left. That's the most accurate part of the model. Then after about 24 hours, turning right. That's the least accurate part of the model.

So, we know this is right. We're not sure here. Got to watch the cone. Big storm, big impact, USA -- Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: Scary stuff, chad. Thanks so much for keeping an eye on it. We'll check back with you.

All right. Time for CNN Money now. Chief business correspondent Christine Romans is in our Money Center.

Good morning, Christine.


The British pound this morning slipping to the weakest against the dollar since 1985. That's a 31-year low. One pound now worth 1.27, the British prime minister moving ahead with the timeline to leave the European union. This so-called Brexit hurting Britain's currency. That weak currency making this the best time in a generation for Americans to take a trip to London.

One of the brightest spots of the American economy may be slowing down a little bit. Car sales have been robust for about seven years. But sales at all three U.S. automakers fell in September.

Despite huge incentives for Labor Day weekend, the average incentive per vehicle in September, look at this, a record high almost $4,000 per car or truck. Low gas prices have consumers moving into pricier trucks and SUVs.

Dealers right now are slashing prices on 2016 models. They're making way for 2017. These incentives are still real big. So, consumers are in the driver's seat. Sorry, Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: I heard you.

ROMANS: I think we're still on track for a record. Could be on track for a record year for car sales. Just a little bit of a pull back there in September.

CAMEROTA: They're just applying the brakes little bit in September.


ROMANS: I love it. A little bit of a road bump.

CAMEROTA: Thanks, Christine. And the sound effects from over here.

So, what do Donald Trump's supporters think about his taxes? Does it make them think twice about voting for him? Find out when we speak to them live, next on NEW DAY.


[06:51:02] CAMEROTA: Hillary Clinton has opened a five-point lead, excuse me, over Donald Trump in a new CNN national poll. Clinton has 47 percent now to Trump's 42 percent. That's in a four-way race. This as controversy swirls around the Trump campaign over the Republican nominee's leaked taxes.


DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: As a businessman and real estate developer, I have legally used the tax laws to my benefit and to the benefit of my company, my investors, and my employees. I mean, honestly, I have brilliantly -- I have brilliantly used those laws.


CAMEROTA: So, what do Donald Trump's supporters think about his taxes as well as any other controversies?

We're joined now by a panel of Republicans and independents who are all Trump supporters. We have Pax Hart, Laire, and Joe Kovac.

Great to see you this morning.


CAMEROTA: Thanks for coming in.

OK. Let me start with you, Pax. If Donald Trump has not paid taxes, federal income tax, for 18 years, what do you think about that?

PAX HART, DONALD TRUMP SUPPORTER: 1995 was the year that he claimed a $916 million loss. I think any small business owner, any business owner in the United States, is going to relate to that. You know, obviously this is on a huge scale, but, you know, I'm a business owner. I've gone through -- when you're running on fumes, you just have to keep putting one foot in front of the other.

What Donald Trump did, this is an incredible comeback story. The law that he used has been used by -- I was looking it up the other day. It's been used by Mark Zuckerberg. It's been used by Oprah Winfrey. It's been used by Warren Buffett. This was a perfectly allowable thing that he did to carry forward those losses.

CAMEROTA: Sure. All those people you've cited, if they carried over and weren't paying federal income tax, they did pay a lot to charity. Those three in particular have given a lot to charity during that time.

Donald Trump, there is no evidence that since 2008 he's given anything to charity, Laire How do you feel about that?

LAIRE, DONALD TRUMP SUPPORTER: Well, neither has the Clinton Foundation. I mean --

CAMEROTA: The Clinton Foundation does give to charity, does all sorts of things globally.

LAIRE: They grossed $178 million or so and gave away $5million. Here's the deal. Here's the thing. How do taxes from 1990 help our economy now? What are the tax policies now?

That's what I'm interested in. I don't care about this tax story. This is from 1990. When you drive down the west side highway, there are Trump Towers all over the place. That's what I'm interested in.

CAMEROTA: So, even though his tax policies out would not change this for real estate developers, it would keep in place that you could somehow skirt paying taxes for 18 years, did that give you pause?

LAIRE: No, it does not. These things are legal. These are laws that are put in place.

What we're doing is discouraging people who take risks in our society. We need people like Donald Trump who take risks and they hire people. They give to the economy. They help the economy.

What you guys are doing is just -- and it's so funny that the liberal media is just so on this when a lot of the liberal personalities don't pay taxes at all. They're in tax trouble. Al Sharpton, you guys love him. He doesn't pay taxes. Joy Reid, all these other people. But you guys are so on this --

CAMEROTA: I'm not familiar with Joy Reid's taxes.

LAIRE: Look it up.

CAMEROTA: We don't love them for not paying taxes.

Joe, what do you think?

JOE KOVAC, DONALD TRUMP SUPPORTER: Well, to me, I don't think it's an issue at all because if these are the tax laws that we have, and if people are upset with them, then we should change the laws. It's very simple, because you're going to hold Donald Trump to one standard, but Hillary Clinton has a double standard where she gets away with everything.

CAMEROTA: Well, she has paid -- I think she's in the 30 percent tax bracket. Those are not equal. She pays taxes.

KOVAC: But it goes beyond taxes. It goes to the double standard throughout this campaign.

CAMEROTA: Let's talk about that.

KOVAC: Donald Trump gets annihilated and held on every single word, period, and comma on everything that he says.

[06:55:08] And then when Hillary says, oh, it was a mistake, then we all forget about it. It's no big deal. What about the e-mails?

CAMEROTA: Let's talk about the e-mails versus the taxes. Do you want to see Donald Trump release his taxes?

KOVAC: I think that if his CPAs and his attorneys indicate that he shouldn't release them because he's under an audit, then he shouldn't release them.

CAMEROTA: So you're not interested in transparency. You don't require as a voter, that kind of transparency.

LAIRE: Transparency --

KOVAC: Transparency, we can't pick and choose when we're going to be transparent.

HART: It's between Donald Trump and the IRS.

CAMEROTA: I'm just asking, as voters, you're not interested.

HART: What I'm more concerned with is the $6 billion that went missing under the State Department under Hillary Clinton. That was our money. This money was Donald Trump's money.

CAMEROTA: Sort of. If he hasn't paid taxes, I challenge you on that, Pax, because if he hasn't paid taxes in 18 years, that means he's not contributed to the military, to veterans affairs, to education system, all the thing he says he's interested in. So, are you OK with a billionaire not contributing to those things for the country?

HART: This goes right to the heart of Hillary Clinton's, you know, rhetoric of --

CAMEROTA: But Donald Trump. Are you uncomfortable with a billionaire --

HART: No, this goes right to the point of, you know, this kind of weird quasi-Marxist class warfare that Hillary Clinton loves to stoke. Donald Trump's tax liability has nothing to do with my tax liability.

CAMEROTA: But it has to do with your country. This is what I'm asking. This means he hasn't contributed to the military and veterans affairs for 18 years. Are you comfortable with that?

HART: Donald Trump was paying real estate taxes. Donald Trump was paying payroll taxes. Donald Trump was paying an unbelievable amount of money.

CAMEROTA: Federal income taxes are what go towards these things. Are you comfortable with that? HART: I am comfortable with Donald Trump, with all of the people who have worked for him. Hundreds of -- tens of thousands -- hundreds of thousands of people that he has employed, that way more than compensates from him using an allowable, you know, loss carried forward.

KOVAC: You even mentioned Mark Zuckerberg and other people that have used this law. Why is it being singled out against Donald Trump?

CAMEROTA: Well, he's running for president, number one. You're interested in transparency. You're very interested in seeing Hillary Clinton's e-mails. That's very important. But not Donald Trump's taxes. So why not transparency?

LAIRE: I find it funny that on Clinton Network News that we're using transparency as a word. Let's talk about transparency.

CAMEROTA: Yes, as you insult us, go on.

LAIRE: We all know you guys are the greatest super PAC for her. The thing is that, I mean, there are so many things -- whatever you guys say about Donald Trump, he can hit back harder on her twice. I mean, everything.

CAMEROTA: She paid taxes, Laire.

LAIRE: Well, you know what?

CAMEROTA: It is a fact. This is part of the record.

KOVAC: But it goes beyond taxes. It's about integrity and trustworthiness. The reason why she had such a problem in the primary against Bernie Sanders was that Democrats did not trust her. A majority of the people in America do not trust her. She says one thing and then she switches her stance.


LAIRE: In transparency, how about she tells us about her black stepson that you guys aren't covering? You talk about Black Lives Matter a lot around here --

CAMEROTA: Laire, you can't just come in and throw a conspiracy theory out and let it smolder there as we're heading to our next hour.

LAIRE: It's not a controversy. Black Lives Matter. Go check out her black stepson. Thank you.

CAMEROTA: Laire, Joe, Pax, we'll be investigating all of that later in the program on our bottom line. Thank you, all.

We're following a lot of news. Let's get right to it.


TRUMP: I understand the tax laws better than almost anyone. I am the one who can fix them.

CLINTON: While millions of American families were paying our fair share, it seems he was contributing nothing to our nation.

TRUMP: 1990s were almost as bad as the Great Depression and far worse than the great recession.

JOE BIDEN, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: This man lacks any sensibilities about the American people. He's dangerous.

SEN. TIM KAINE (D), VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: It's an exciting time. We are no the home stretch now.

GOV. MIKE PENCE (R), VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: The choice could not be more clear. The stakes could not be higher.

CUOMO: Joe Biden, finish the sentence.

BIDEN: Joe Biden --

ANNOUNCER: This is NEW DAY with Chris Cuomo and Alisyn Camerota.


CUOMO: All right. Good morning. Welcome to your NEW DAY.

Up first, Hillary Clinton retaking the top spot in a new CNN national poll. Clinton now with a five-point lead, 47 percent, 42 percent, in the four-way race. Clinton with a 20-point advantage among independent women voters, 55 to 35. Trump is up four points among independent men, a big slip there.

Clinton also the overwhelming voice of black voters with 95 percent.

CAMEROTA: All of this as Donald Trump attacks the political fire storm over his taxes, touting his own financial brilliance, and possibly avoiding federal taxes for nearly two decades.

(Byline: Chris Cuomo, Alisyn Camerota, David Gregory, Matt Lewis, David Chalian, Chad Myers, Christine Romans)

(Guest: Laire, Joe Kovac, Pax Hart)

(High: Vice presidential nominees Mike Pence and Tim Kaine face off tonight 9:00 p.m. Eastern. Florida, North Carolina, declaring states of emergency ahead of the arrival of Hurricane Matthew because of what they're expecting. Sales at all three U.S. automakers fell in September. Donald Trump's supporters talked about his taxes as well as any other controversies.)

(Spec: Mike Pence; Tim Kaine; Elections; Government; Hurricane Matthew; Safety; Storms; Automotive Industry; Business; Donald Trump; Politics)